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Sticky:Dev Blog: Bounties, Kill Rights, New Modules and War in Retribution

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 47 post(s)

CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 234	Posted - 2012.11.21 17:17:00 - [1] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: CCP SoniClover wrote: WeGÇÖve added an option for people to limit who the kill right is available to. Now when you make a kill right available, you can choose to restrict access the kill right to a specific corporation, alliance or even character. You can still make it open to anyone if you wish. When you make a kill right available, a notification is sent to the target of the kill right informing him that the kill right has been made available (and to whom if that is specified). This is what's going to take killrights to the next level and you guys are heroes for getting it into Retribution. Thank player feedback. They convinced us this had to happen now rather than in a point-release.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 234	Posted - 2012.11.21 17:33:00 - [2] - Quote Gneeznow wrote: Btw this 'available to all' on the killrights, does this mean it's available to view and buy by anyone? Yes, anyone.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 234	Posted - 2012.11.21 17:45:00 - [3] - Quote Callic Veratar wrote: If someone buys my kill rights, activating the flag, and then I immediately withdraw them, what happens? Is the suspect flag withdrawn? Does it stay active but disable the kill right payout? This is a very exploitable edge case that wasn't addressed in the blog. If the kill right has been activated, making it unavailable won't change anything - the flag stays on and the kill right can still be used up.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 245	Posted - 2012.11.22 09:58:00 - [4] - Quote Nalha Saldana wrote: Oh my god you can activate MJD and cloak instantly then you will remain cloak for the spool up time AND be cloaked when landing, just tried on bucky. This is a defect that will be fixed before Retribution. Sorry


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 245	Posted - 2012.11.22 10:01:00 - [5] - Quote Pat0chan wrote: What I understand for this new kill right stuff, is that now High sec is even more dangerous to fly in than before! Eg: I fly a freighter (wich cant defend, cant cloack, cant do ****) from gate to gate... A chap scan me down, see i carry goods, place a kill right on me... Next gate I have a whole system waiting for me to be poped and of course Concord will not move anymore. Or I'm mining in a belt didnt ask anything to anybody, a space fellas jump in belt, place a kill right and booom dead again. Did I understood the new kill right system correctly? There is an important difference between bounties and kill rights. Bounties can be placed on anyone, but this never leads to you becoming a legal target. A kill right is only created if you do something that flags you as a criminal.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 246	Posted - 2012.11.22 10:36:00 - [6] - Quote The Zerg Overmind wrote: Sorry I'm late to the party here. A few questions: 1.) Will the wardec retraction feature be part of the game at launch of the expansion? Or released sometime in the weeks that follow? The wording can be interpreted both ways and I want to be able to tell people when they should expect to be free. This change will be in Retribution. The Zerg Overmind wrote: 2.) The intention here seems to be to shift wardec favor back towards the aggressors because there are no longer consequences for biting off more than they can chew. Is the 24hr retraction timer a final solution or a stopgap measure for something else? The retract war option is only available if the war is made mutual by the defender. So declaring a war is always going to lock you in that war for 7 days, unless a surrender (or this new mutual/retract) option is used, but that is not a one-sided decision by the aggressor. The Zerg Overmind wrote: 3.) Have you considered letting corps with outgoing wars join alliances? (Just forbid them from declaring outgoing wars after their app has been accepted) At the moment there is no plan to allow this.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 261	Posted - 2012.11.23 17:37:00 - [7] - Quote Michael Harari wrote: Michael Harari wrote: CCP SoniClover wrote: Nalha Saldana wrote: Oh my god you can activate MJD and cloak instantly then you will remain cloak for the spool up time AND be cloaked when landing, just tried on bucky. This is a defect that will be fixed before Retribution. Sorry What about the defect where you can MJD out of a hundred long points, land on a hundred seboed interceptors and still warp away before any of them lock you, in your triple plate baddon? Asking again. The MJD basically has the same limitations as a MWD, so this scenario is possibly, if you're well aligned.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 261	Posted - 2012.11.26 11:55:00 - [8] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: James Amril-Kesh wrote: James Amril-Kesh wrote: If I understand the kill rights mechanic, making your kill right available to everyone means everyone can buy the kill right at any time. As you pointed out, if the kill right is cheap then people are going to have alts or friends blow up their rookie ships to get rid of the kill right, and if the kill right is expensive there's no too high a chance of it being activated by most people. However, think about what this does to the bounty hunting profession. Suppose you're looking around for people with kill rights for sale and you want to rack up kills for yourself. Since people with cheap kill rights aren't going to keep them for very long and are most likely to easily discard them, I'm left with kill rights I'll have to pay a fair amount of isk for. Let's say most kill rights that aren't easily discarded run in the 50-100 million isk range. What incentive do I have to pay for a kill right that once activated, anybody in the vicinity can take advantage of? If I buy a killright I should be paying to have the chance to take someone down myself, not to make it so CONCORD completely ignores aggression from anyone and everyone at that time. This game mechanic makes absolutely no sense. Why should I pay for everyone else to shoot the same target I want to shoot at? Why can't I just pay for myself to shoot at the target? EVEN IF this kill right was restricted to my corporation or just me, when I activate it that still gives everyone in the vicinity the opportunity to attack. The only thing this really changes is who is forced to pay to activate the kill right, and who gets to decide when and where the engagement is. There's absolutely no control whatsoever on who can get involved. This doesn't make any sense. Still waiting for comment on this. People have to be careful when activating a kill right about time and place. This is by design.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 261	Posted - 2012.11.26 14:37:00 - [9] - Quote Lord Zim wrote: CCP SoniClover wrote: People have to be careful when activating a kill right about time and place. This is by design. So, what happens if I pay, say, 100m to activate someone's killright, 20 others join in and shoot at him, and someone in that group gets the final shot, who gets to loot and who gets the bounty (if there is any)? The one who gets the final blow gets the bounty (and shares it with anyone in his fleet, if any). A wreck of a suspect is open to loot by anyone (so anyone of the 20 players in your example could loot legally).


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 14:13:00 - [10] - Quote Alexander Renoir wrote: Why do you exclude your own employees from this crappy bounty system? Because we want the Most Wanted list to reflect realistic targets for people to chase. This becomes especially more relevant if we implement increased payout percentage based on Most Wanted list placement. So we don't want to clutter this list with targets that players cannot interact with in-game on regular basis, like ISD or Dev characters. As others have pointed out in this thread, security rating has very little to do with how 'good' or 'evil' a character is. For instance, someone could margin scam you or steal from your corporation, yet have very high security standing.



CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 14:25:00 - [11] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: Well I guess the dev team, despite the appearance they've tried to convey, have completely stopped taking any feedback on this atrocity and all that's left is the horrifying combination of prescience and a train crash. I have responded that activating a Suspect flag is by design and there is nothing in the feedback that has been given that shows that has to change. Yes, this system is different, and more harsh in many ways, yes, it will mean some people will have to adapt, yes, it means changes in some player behavior. None of these are a show-stopper. None of the arguments that have been made has convinced the team we need to change this. We do make changes based on feedback when we agree it needs to happen, allowing the owner of a kill right to be more specific in choosing whom to make the kill right available to is one example of this. You may not agree to this decision, but there is a difference between listening to feedback and acting upon it and one does not exclude the other.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 14:39:00 - [12] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: I just don't see how it makes any sense that a kill right I pay for can be capitalized on by anyone, even if I'm the only one who's allowed to activate the kill right. Why would I pay for the ability for everyone to shoot my target? It doesn't incentivize bounty hunting nearly as much as you think it does. The only possible hope I could have is that I could eventually get the victim on their own and then activate the killright, but realistically that's pretty much never going to happen. I agree it doesn't incentivize bounty hunting as much as some other solutions, but we felt it is better for the kill right system itself to be the way it is. Perhaps down the road we can combine the two if we can allow people to place bounty only available to certain entities. We're now looking into if/how to implement placing a bounty on a structure, which will require some fundamental changes to the bounty system, as it's more of a one-time contract kill than a general pool. Based on those changes, it might be possible to do something similar on character/corp/alliance level, but it's too early to tell. Something like that might be ideal way to marry the new bounty system to the new kill right system, but for Retribution we felt it was better to focus on the individual needs of the two systems.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 14:41:00 - [13] - Quote Lord Zim wrote: CCP SoniClover wrote: James Amril-Kesh wrote: Well I guess the dev team, despite the appearance they've tried to convey, have completely stopped taking any feedback on this atrocity and all that's left is the horrifying combination of prescience and a train crash. I have responded that activating a Suspect flag is by design and there is nothing in the feedback that has been given that shows that has to change. Yes, this system is different, and more harsh in many ways, yes, it will mean some people will have to adapt, yes, it means changes in some player behavior. None of these are a show-stopper. None of the arguments that have been made has convinced the team we need to change this. We do make changes based on feedback when we agree it needs to happen, allowing the owner of a kill right to be more specific in choosing whom to make the kill right available to is one example of this. You may not agree to this decision, but there is a difference between listening to feedback and acting upon it and one does not exclude the other. So, since you're answering about killrights, bounties etc, is my understanding that even if a killright is set to a specific person, corp or alliance, they still have to pay the price the killright owner has set it at, which is anything from 0 to infinity? Since I've assumed this before, and I haven't been corrected, I'm going to assume this is indeed how it will work in future. Yes, this is true. We did have a design for allowing the owner of the kill right even more control over the availability, with multiple price points. For instance, he could make it available to everyone for X amount, to corp A for Y amount and his own corp for Z amount. But the UI complexity on this was something we decided to wait upon implementing.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 14:48:00 - [14] - Quote Lord Zim wrote: So, pray tell, why should I become a bountyhunter when I have to pay anything from 0 to x isk to activate a killright, so everyone else can try to shoot him for 15 minutes, get the bounty (if present) and loot (if present)? What's in it for me? If you want to be a serous bounty hunter, then low sec is going to be your main hunting ground. I seriously doubt there will be enough players with high bounty, available kill right and flying an expensive ship in hi sec for anyone to make a career out of being a bounty hunter based on that alone.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 262	Posted - 2012.11.30 15:05:00 - [15] - Quote Lord Zim wrote: So instead of making the transferrable killright something which could be transferred to another person/corp/alliance with a specific bounty on it (you know, so bountyhunters could've actually been a viable profession even in hisec), it's made into a hisec vigilante tool, specifically designed to be the final counter against freighter/miner ganking. I see. The kill right system has been in the game since 2005, yet has never really worked as originally intended. Less than 1% of kill rights are actually used. The kill right system now has a higher chance of actually leading to retribution. So the intent here is to fix a system implemented in RMR to be more functional.


CCP SoniClover C C P C C P Alliance 270	Posted - 2012.12.06 11:31:00 - [16] - Quote Cordo Draken wrote: Lolmer wrote: I was going to reply to http://adharkhorin.com/2012/12/kill-right-scamming/ that CONCORD takes the cost when selling a kill right, but none of the Dev Blogs nor even http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Kill_rights#Selling_and_buying_kill_rights mentions who gets the money. Please correct http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Kill_rights#Selling_and_buying_kill_rights with who gets the money when a kill right being sold is activated. Yeah, I was trying to find Any literature on this important piece of info. Since SoniClover was vague on this, anyone test this out to verify who gets the isk? Are Killrights an ISK sink or have new value to the owner? Sorry for being vague on this, that was unintentional. The ISK goes to the owner of the kill right, not to Concord. I-¦ll look into getting the wiki updated to be more clear.